Fin24

Motsepe: Nationalisation does not work

2011-09-01 07:53

Johannesburg - The South African business community is impotent in influencing policy decisions - such as in the debate over nationalisation - and needs to work at it, says Patrice Motsepe, the country’s foremost businessman.

In a Johannesburg presentation on Wednesday Motsepe, who a year ago drew harsh criticism for declining to take a stand on the nationalisation of the mining industry, bluntly stated that the nationalisation debate would not be held in any developed country because experience had repeatedly proved that it did not work.

"The subject would not be discussed in either America or Europe," he told fund managers, analysts and bankers who attended a presentation of the annual results of his company, African Rainbow Minerals [JSE:ARM].

A year ago certain fund managers, shareholders and mining analysts were upset because he flatly refused to lash out at nationalisation. At that time he said, among other things, that if nationalisation of the mines was the will of the people of South Africa, he would accept it.

He had not wanted to comment aggressively on the matter because in such a debate all parties should be permitted to express their views. Businesspeople needed to maintain credibility.

South Africa is at a critical juncture and discussion is required, said Motsepe. "We also need to be patient with and tolerant of each other," he said in reference to his previous position.

He made a compelling plea for the organised business sector to become more effective in its efforts to influence policy decisions. He pointed out that Limpopo has already formally decided to support the nationalisation of mines at the party’s policy congress mid-2012.

Those who determined economic policy in South Africa, he said, were not in the room and their influence on policy decisions was disproportionally large. The business sector simply had to speak to them, because such decisions had an enormous impact on all concerned.

"The nationalisation debate, for instance, has a huge effect on the mining industry," he said.

But South African business executives have no experience of attending central meetings on policy - such as the ANC’s policy conference or its national conference - where they can explain their positions, he said.

"We have to speak to the ANC," said Motsepe. The ANC is weak at attracting white votes, he continued, and needs to formulate policy that embraces all South Africans.

Business people, he said, must also remember that SA is a developing country with a mixed economy - and the country’s future wellbeing resides in a mixed economy.

He said the creation of a state mining company should be welcomed and supported as it is appropriate for the state to have its own mines. It is necessary to find common ground. Investments by the private sector and a state mining company could constitute a possible area of commonality, he said.

Motsepe played a key role in the 2003 establishment of Business Unity South Africa - an  umbrella body incorporating racially based business organisations. But Busa has been threatening to disband in recent months.

“We must do everything in our power to ensure that white and black business people stay united,” he said.

 - For business news in Afrikaans, go to Sake24.

Comments
  • Carl - 2011-09-01 08:24

    Finally a person who just speaks sense, without attacking all and sundry. We need more of this in our country!

  • E_O - 2011-09-01 08:26

    Wow, well said Patrice Motsepe

  • Felix - 2011-09-01 08:27

    Motsepe were have you been all my life? Legend.

  • Nasdaq7 - 2011-09-01 08:31

    Private businesses do better. Government can even fund / help new mining companies - BEE companies, but keep that which is good: private business.

  • Gustaf - 2011-09-01 08:32

    Only successful miners like Motsepe would appose nationalisation. It's the failed miners who support it as a way to bail them out.

  • Trist - 2011-09-01 08:32

    There was an article in the recent Economist about the "Queensway Syndicate", a group of Chinese investors who are manipulating African, and pther governments to get mineral wealth at low prices.Interestingly,our proponents of nationIisation have associated strongly with countries which are tied to this syndicate, including Zimbabwe and Venezuela.

  • FU2 - 2011-09-01 08:42

    You need big I mean very big balls and a very loud speaker to tell Malema and his Fools that because they seem not understand that except loading their own pockets with loot.

  • Badballie - 2011-09-01 08:46

    nationalization internationally isn't accepted and hasn't "worked" as it is counter to the policies of shareholders and profit driven owners. Democracy on the other hand can be directly linked to the decline in modern civilization, this being compounded by the sell out of its people by most government currently in power.

  • Dougalan - 2011-09-01 08:54

    The problem is that decisions like nationalisation of the mines are put forward by people like Juju who have absolutely no clue what they are talking about. We only have to look at the disastrous failure of Aurora, owned by Mandela and Zuma's descendants, to see what can happen when inexperienced people try to take over a mine.

      River Tam - 2011-09-01 10:52

      I disagree, Juju has looked at other examples and saw how rich he can get. He disregarded all other evidence, because he is too uneducated and frankly stupid to understand the implications. He just saw how many more Breitling watches and Sandton mansions he can buy.

  • Geetsy - 2011-09-01 08:57

    Nice one Pat..

  • sparky34 - 2011-09-01 08:58

    majority of those who are preaching nationalisation they are thinking of themselves not the poorest of the poor, they want to continue to enrich thmselves at the expense of the unemployed.

  • sparky34 - 2011-09-01 09:00

    say what???

  • chris.khanye - 2011-09-01 09:03

    Mr Motsepe thank you for coming into this unnecessary debate. Thank you for putting this debate into perspective: the nationalisation debate would not be held in any developed country because experience had repeatedly proved that it did not work. Under the stupor of unlimited tenders, populist hooligans desperate to get their names into dustbins of history will be desperate to differ. The uneducated, unemployed, frustrated, destitute youth will listen and consume anything propagated by a populist idealist in their name. History taught us about Unongqawuza and her false prophercies during the Xhosas and British frontier wars and I guess the sorry saga continues - but this time it's hooligans prophecy. But then I always see light where most are desperate - this will be the quickest receipt for SA to have a bloody revolution surpassing the Arab Spring to topple a few polically connected who will benefit from nationalization. Nationalization is just an outdated and presently overrated lie!!

  • Ricardo mafuna - 2011-09-01 09:05

    Why am i not suprised with Motsepe's Position on Nationalisation of mines,Nationalisation must happen we cant have people like Motsepe Benefiting on the Country's resource while South Africans remain Poor.the only they are able to do is exploit African People.wether through Nationalisation or in other way,South African wealth Must Be distributed amongst them. Motsepe's Position on Nationalisation of mines,Nationalisation must happen we cant have people like Motsepe Benefiting on the Country's resource while South Africans remain Poor.the only they are able to do is exploit African People.wether through Nationalisation or in other way,South African wealth Must Be distributed amongst them.

      Nasdaq7 - 2011-09-01 10:35

      Why don't you just create businesses and jobs? Redistributing wealth won't create an income for people. Income is a monthly way of getting wealth. Distribution of wealth is once-off and it is gone.

      River Tam - 2011-09-01 10:49

      Wealth redistribution does not work, has been proven not to work and no amount of populist slogans will make it work. If people like you were to actually to look at other nations in the world you will be able to see that. Unfortunately, you think the world begins and ands with South Africa and it's good neighbour Robert Mugabe, the other nations no matter their colour are all 'imperialist'. And then we wonder why the world laughs at the "African agenda".

      gatvol4corru - 2011-09-01 17:40

      Good questions, Pity Nationalisation did not work in USSR? Remember them comrade???? Only the ANC and selected comrades benefit! Load the pickets comrades!

  • IC1 - 2011-09-01 09:07

    Yep I agree, it wont work, he on the other hand says it wont work coz he will loose too much cash

  • JustinD - 2011-09-01 09:08

    An educated man in the right position can offer so much......Patrice for President.

      changeisGood - 2011-09-01 15:57

      Mbeki is a well educated man as well.

      changeisGood - 2011-09-01 15:57

      Thabo Mbeki that is.

  • swoan - 2011-09-01 09:09

    these are the kind of blacks I will give my ear to, educated, hard working, smart, intelligent and rich! if we can make Motsepe a case study and give it to Malema, he is a shining example of how blacks can turn their lifes around, if he can win a lotto today, promise you he wont knock down his R3.4m house to build an R16m house!

  • GypseyAnn - 2011-09-01 09:09

    Patrice, grab Julius and let him know all the facts. It's great to see that someone of your standing can speak up on this matter.

  • Phil K - 2011-09-01 09:11

    The people who knows how it works, says it won't work. The people who don't know how it works think it will work. Yet somehow the masses choose to listen to the people who don't know, rather than the people who do. African economic logic 101 - Boom! You're welcome.

  • africanwolf - 2011-09-01 09:21

    Of course Nationalisation does not work i was born in the Soviet union ,and look where are they today. the only ones who benefited from nationalisation, were the top government leaders, where the rest of the people remained poor. A solution for unemployment is to close all the China towns countrywide and stop cheap imports, this will create at least 10000000 jobs. Reintroduce military service for one year , and make all 18 years old boys serve they're country for one year.(girls can work in the hospitals) this will solve 2 problems 1. Race problem will fade away with time as all races will serve in the army/police/hospitals and eventually will know each other better and become friends. 2.it will solve crime and illegal border crossing as there will be enough man power.for the Chinese if they want to do business in SA, they must import the equipment, employ South Africans, and manufacture locally.

      DW - 2011-09-01 10:22

      africanwolf, the only fair way to close the China towns is if the SA workforce can produce the products at a price that approximates the price of the Chinese products. Those imports come in, AFTER import duty, and are still a quarter of the price of locally produced goods. I wonder why? Maybe because the Chinese workers are willing to work very, very hard. Productivity is everything. They dont strike and burn and break. And guess what? They have jobs. They have money (they may not be rich, but they do earn a living instead of living in squatter shacks and demanding the government to give them everything for free). Funny how the self same squatters in SA are the ones who buy the cheap Chinese imports, because they cannot afford the South African ones. Ironic, isnt it?

      clx - 2011-09-01 10:32

      so instead of nationalising the banks and mines we should just let government employ and pay everybody. wake up, that is nationalisation and even more expensive at that. to forc emilitary service on 100 000 matrics every year, thats as many salaries as the entire mining sector pays, so who is going to pay for that? military service beging 'good' for everyone is a concept of dictators and opressors.

      Arno - 2011-09-01 10:33

      We have some of the most expensive labour in the world, not to mention undisciplined and lazy. That's why we can't compete. I agree fully with national service, but at the moment our military is just as bad as the criminals. Education standards need to be lifted exponentially, equal opportunities must be truly equal, scrap BEE and EE. Enforce and explain BBBEE to the benefit of all, white included as the principals of BBBEE are to improve living standards of the community. Completely ban unions, if you don't want to work you don't get a job, unions keep the willing unemployed and the useless employed. JUST FOLLOW THE RULE OF THE LAW as simple as that, basic things like stopping at a bloody red light, not littering respecting life etc.. The chinese are were they are as a result of impeccable work ethic and absolute dedication to quality, africans are exactly the opposite - unfortunately. Get the foundations right and build up from there. Bring back the death penalty and include rapists and repeat offenders, if you can't be rehabilitated better get rid of you, as in china. PRIVATISE PRIVATISE PRIVATISE, the only answer to ineffective government departments. Done.

      The Observer - 2011-09-01 11:41

      Are you blaming Nationalism or individuals? Why is it working in China, Venezuela, Botswana etc?

      Aaron Gumede - 2011-09-01 11:54

      You can't gleebly claim that nationalism is not working while it works on other countries with better leaders who are less corrupt than yours. Blame your Russian corrupt leaders and not the theory. The intentions of nationalism are spotless and blameless, just that implementors are corrupt.Next time when you comment, don't blame nationalism.

  • Voorvel - 2011-09-01 09:21

    Mooi Patrice, What a boytjie!! Go for President, wine farms and all!!!

  • hehe - 2011-09-01 09:22

    Motsepe for President!

  • Clive25 - 2011-09-01 09:23

    How did you get all your riches Mr Motsepe. Whether you like it or not nationalisation will go ahead. I doubt you will take the same stance if you did not own any mine, hypocrite.

      DW - 2011-09-01 10:15

      Hey Clive, those shares are available on the stock exchange for you to buy some if you want them so badly. But it will mean you will have to work for the money to pay for them. Too much to ask?

      willieman - 2011-09-01 15:12

      I do not think you are contributing to this debate,give facts the pro and cons of the whole thing.Do not come with your vuvuzela/hearsay mentality.DEBATE RATIONALY

  • Ed - 2011-09-01 09:24

    Sho Mr Motsepe, it took you a while:) But very well done for speaking out. I just wish that many more leaders, of all races, would have the balls to stand-up for what they believe and to speak out. Many business people have this view that if they speak out in an open democracy, that what they say will harm their business. What they do not realise is taht if they do not speak-out, it is not just their business taht can be harmed, but also Democracy and the entire good of the nation! ed.

  • Jeremy - 2011-09-01 09:24

    The ANCYL does not work either, nor the ANC in that matter... ANC run Municipalities dont work, but for some reason the DA run Western Cape DOES work! eish, South Africa - I love you and I dont like to see you crumble and burn...

      Ayoba - 2011-09-01 14:45

      @Jeremy, thank you for canvassing for DA. But isn't it too early to do that or maybe you commenting on the wrong article?

  • Joubs - 2011-09-01 09:25

    Can we vote this guy in as president? He knows what is going on in this country more than JZ!!!

      changeisGood - 2011-09-01 15:43

      lol, I don't think so, Mr. Motsepe is a capitalist. finish and klaar.

  • Nawe - 2011-09-01 09:27

    Ja sure, maybe its because of wich side of the fence do u belong.

  • OLIBO - 2011-09-01 09:27

    I find it interesting that African people who have "made it" tend to forget where they come from. Would Patrice be a billionaire today without the liberation brought by the ANC? Is it a coincidence that his sister married Jeff Radebe when he was the minister of minerals and energy and overnight Patrice became a mining tycoon? People who call for nationalisation see people like Patrice amassing personal wealth from the mineral wealth of this country, whilst the masses remain in poverty. Instead of criticising nationalisation, business people must come up with alternative solutions to address poverty. It is not enough to cry about lack of skills and that it takes time to address poverty, whilst people like Patrice are banking billions every year. I agree that business must engage the government on the economic policy, but they must come-up with solutions.

      DW - 2011-09-01 10:14

      I dont know Patrice or how he made his billions. If there was corruption involved, I certainly dont support it. However YOU have the same opportunities. BEE is open to you. What are you doing about it?

      Arno - 2011-09-01 10:25

      The only problem is that the masses are sheep who will follow the loudest voice, regardless of the bigger picture. instant gratification is the name of the game, a game the ANC plays very well. Don't know if anybody's noticed but about a month or two before every election the ANC gooi free concerts and give away t-shirts and chicken etc.. then after they get the votes they go back to the good old ways of self enrichment and couldn't care less about the promises they made. Unfortunately the masses' attention span isn't very long and they get used and abused over and over. Only if they can start thinking for themselves can we solve our country's problems, but alas it's never going to happen. Easier to control if they only think as a group, as a group that only follows and NEVER questions. Absolutely LOVE this country but the cancer is spreading...

      clx - 2011-09-01 10:27

      @Olibo Business and intelectuals have said since 1996 what needs to be done to create jobs and alleviate poverty. The calls focussed on 3 major ideas: Focus on wealth creation instead of wealth re-distribution, focus on job and business friendly environment, and focus on a stabel, corruption free public sector The government laughed them off, focussed on redistrubution, killed the small business and job creation, failed to eliminate blatant corruption and now, as predicted, we have made 0 progress after 17 years. the poor are still poor. by redistributing wealth the government has redistributed poverty, and not created any new wealth. take a simple spreadsheet and calculate the impact of 6% growth per year over 15 years. it would have doubeled the economy. so it the government had focussed on 6% growth instead of BEE, half of the economy would have been in black hands today (since every new job could only have been filled by non-whites, as most whites were qualified and employed already). The ANC killed the chances of the poor.

      Aaron Gumede - 2011-09-01 11:55

      Well said

      gatvol4corru - 2011-09-01 17:37

      Well said!

  • lesangkgang.montlhabaki - 2011-09-01 09:29

    BEE worked in your favour Patrice, how many of us is it going to take for it to benefit us if not Nationalisation, remember we were sold out in Irene Discussions and everyone just made money and left, now is the time for those who never benefited and put in the loop to know the truth and NATIONALISE. Viva Malema and Viva to the new leaders of tomorrow. Cde Feather

      DW - 2011-09-01 10:11

      The reason BEE worked in Patrice's favour is because he used the opportunities open to him. He took what was offered and, using business sense and hard work, applied his mind in how he could make it work for him. You have the EXACT SAME opportunities. What is stopping YOU from making BEE work in your favour? I will tell you, if you dont know. It is a demanding gimme mentality. You want it all for nothing. You dont want to have to lift a finger. It must just be handed over to you on a platter. I can see why you support Malema.

      clx - 2011-09-01 10:29

      Business and intelectuals have said since 1996 what needs to be done to create jobs and alleviate poverty. The calls focussed on 3 major ideas: Focus on wealth creation instead of wealth re-distribution, focus on job and business friendly environment, and focus on a stabel, corruption free public sector The government laughed them off, focussed on redistrubution, killed the small business and job creation, failed to eliminate blatant corruption and now, as predicted, we have made 0 progress after 17 years. the poor are still poor. by redistributing wealth the government has redistributed poverty, and not created any new wealth. take a simple spreadsheet and calculate the impact of 6% growth per year over 15 years. it would have doubeled the economy. so it the government had focussed on 6% growth instead of BEE, half of the economy would have been in black hands today, and double the economy at that (since every new job could only have been filled by non-whites, as most whites were qualified and employed already). The ANC killed the chances of the poor.

      Batman - 2011-09-01 10:59

      Your gripe is against the manner in which BEE was implemented (with millions of others). To correct that, you should not nationalise, but revamp BEE and, whilst you are at it, also get rid of cronyism, nepotism, pigism (feeding at the trough), tenderpreneurs, etc, etc.

      K@renB - 2011-09-01 11:11

      Get your head out of the sand and see and accept the reality - NATIONALISATION DOES NOT WORK!!! Unless of course you don't give a sh*t about morals and ethics and are happy to become greedy, corrupt and fat just like today's leaders and cronies living off the sweat of your own people's hard work and toil? Grow up and wake up!

  • Booswig Visagie - 2011-09-01 09:29

    I like Motsepe's comments. Sensible. Rational. Something we need right now to steady the ship... He should consider running for president. I'd support him.

  • Nasdaq7 - 2011-09-01 09:32

    is bout tym u said somethin motsepe, maybe they ll listen 2 u.

  • TheWasp - 2011-09-01 09:35

    What's the point of putting up a comment window when you NEVER publish them on Fin24......wake up News24??????

      Ayoba - 2011-09-01 14:40

      @TheWasp, this one is published. Please dont cry. Just put your other comment under mine. Happy? But be careful no one decide to report your comment.

  • Sipho - 2011-09-01 09:37

    Motsepe's comment its timed because his partner in crime is charge and he is starting to take a stand as if he is against meanwhile he is not.

      gatvol4corru - 2011-09-01 17:36

      WTF are you trying to say numnuts?

  • lamha vukawe - 2011-09-01 09:38

    Yeah I bet he doesnt want to have his mines nationalised!

  • anorkie - 2011-09-01 09:39

    Well nationalisation did not work in Zambia, we do not need to go far to see the results. Just look at the mess Eskom is in, they also belong to the state and we still have rolling black outs and TV's telling us how we need to operate our electrical appliances.

  • chris.khanye - 2011-09-01 09:41

    Finally Motsepe has joined the debate about nationalization and his perspective: bluntly stated that the nationalisation debate would not be held in any developed country because experience had repeatedly proved that it did not work. But populist will harshly deal with this dissenting view. At school I was taught the history of British and Xhosas frontier wars and the story Unongqawuza. Uneducated, unemployed, destitute, frustrated youth will consume anything from popular idealists since it gives them hope. But this hope is futile because nationalization is just a popular overrated lie. Those who propagate nationalization are filthy rich today because of the privatization of public services. And like tenderpreneurship - only a few politically connected will benefit from nationalization. Nationalization propaganists continue with Unongqawuza sorry saga - giving false hope.

      IC1 - 2011-09-01 10:43

      Exactly, agree with you

      The Observer - 2011-09-01 11:37

      I expect you to put your reasons why nationalism will not work in South Africa, not echoeing Motsepe like you are doing. You are only attacking individuals with their reasonable views but can't provide any reason why not nationalism. The tribal wars with the Britons is not an issue now but nationalism and her disadvantages. The developed world are major beneficiaries in our resources, they took them develop their countries and their people and the same Motsepe is enriching himself, family and friends. There is a guy who knows him, he made a party in Randjies and fetch poor Kgabalatsane people people and in that party, he issued cars to his family. That according to me was just too much to the poor Kgabalatsane people. Then drive to Kgabalatsane and see that area. You guys are just slaves who are made to serve others interests.There is indeed something to lose from Motsepe but what about you in this nationalism issue? Are you gaining anything today? Loose-Loose? So why?

      Aaron Gumede - 2011-09-01 11:49

      I expect you to put your reasons why nationalism will not work in South Africa, not echoeing Motsepe like you are doing. You are only attacking individuals with their reasonable views but can't provide any reason why not nationalism. The tribal wars with the Britons is not an issue now but nationalism and her disadvantages. The developed world are major beneficiaries in our resources, they took them develop their countries and their people and the same Motsepe is enriching himself, family and friends. There is a guy who knows him, he made a party in Randjies and fetch poor Kgabalatsane people people and in that party, he issued cars to his family. That according to me was just too much to the poor Kgabalatsane people. Then drive to Kgabalatsane and see that area. You guys are just slaves who are made to serve others interests.There is indeed something to lose from Motsepe but what about you in this nationalism issue? Are you gaining anything today? Loose-Loose? So why?

      Raymond - 2011-09-01 14:27

      I agree with what You are saying Chris, and Aaron listen to what he is saying..... to do the same thibg twice and expect a different result is insanity.....

  • Dumisani - 2011-09-01 09:42

    Motsepe,please run for pres... i will vote for u

  • Aaron Gumede - 2011-09-01 09:56

    I can't expect a different opinion from him, he stand to loose. As for whites, that is just rubish, where in the ANC policy are whites excluded.

      Darkwing Duck - 2011-09-01 14:19

      Aaron, whites are not excluded in policy, they are excluded in practice. The ANC has a fine set of policies, and it's freedom charter is to be praised. However, the ANC in power is not the same ANC on paper.

      Shrike - 2011-09-01 15:15

      Take BEE for one, it states that up to 80% of positions should be placed with "black" staff......taking into consideration that our economy is NOT growing this means that "white" people shall not be considered for employment..... All fair and well for people of color, but what about the whites? Reverse Apartheid! Racist legislation that is designed to exclude "whites" Next one..... BEE business ownership..... Businesses are not considered for tenders without "black" ownership, so even if the "whites" start their own companies after they were not considered for jobs they are EXCLUDED from economic activity....... The ANC is not a NON racial party, but a pro Africal "black" party that considers the "whites" and the "winging whites". They do not listen to white concerns and do not care at all..... That is why there are no whites voting for the ANC...... Why would they?!?!?

      Truth24 - 2011-09-01 15:39

      Ermm how about BEE?

      dogue - 2011-09-01 15:57

      In all of it. Best example: affirmative action policy. The ANC is basically kicking whites (and skilled non-whites) out of SA.

      dogue - 2011-09-01 16:08

      In all of it. Best example: affirmative action policy. The ANC is basically kicking whites (and skilled non-whites) out of SA. (This is the second attempt to post this. Is this some technical glitch or censorship?)

  • Jason - 2011-09-01 10:02

    Jack: Where were you born? Malema: South Africa ... Jack: Which part? Malema: What 'which part'? The whole body was born in South Africa .

      Ayoba - 2011-09-01 14:36

      Old joke buddy. Try something new.

  • lmpcurtainsl - 2011-09-01 10:13

    What you are saying sir is very much aloof to the majority and the propects of this country - 'business people shoould have a say in influencing policy'... first of all who are the majority business holders in S.A?, I totaly disagree to you capitaists tactics sir.

  • Neo - 2011-09-01 10:16

    What you are saying sir is very much aloof to the majority and the propects of this country - 'business people shoould have a say in influencing policy'... first of all who are the majority business holders in S.A?, I totaly disagree to you capitaists tactics sir.

      Succubus - 2011-09-01 17:45

      Business people are the ones who 'feed' the majority. Nationalize the private sector and businesses will no longer be able to 'feed' the majority. A simple concept, that some how eludes the majority of Africa's inhabitance. Failure to understand this basic economic principle is why most of Africa is unable to 'feed' it's self. I hope the majority, if it is in deed the majority, of South Africa's population are able to evolve in intellectual capacity quick enough to overt the same economic crisis that infects every African country who's 'majority' bite the hands that feed them. I choose to believe that South Africa is some how different, that some how the 'majority' of people in South Africa are different to the mindless masses of stupidity that infest the rest of the continent. I some how hope that there is some glimmer of intellectual hope among the 'majority' of our country, and that the light bulb will suddenly turn on, and they will finally 'understand', before its to late. Once a countries economy has been nationalized into quantitative oblivion, to the point that poor people can't even afford a loaf of bread, its to late for business to step in and save it. Its time for the 'majority' of this country's population to break the circle of poverty that has plagued Africa since the dawn of time, and support their own economy. Support the business community of this country, as they are the reason you have a job and are not starving to death like the rest of Africa.

  • bimbo - 2011-09-01 10:16

    No wonder this gentleman has what he has today. Well done Sir, perhaps you can use your influence to spread the word!!! As a country we need more people of your calibre. With this kind of sense, there is indeed a future for our country for all its people. Thank you.

  • DW - 2011-09-01 10:31

    Agreed, TheWasp. What is the point of having a "Reply to xxx" feature if the replies are never, ever featured on Fin24? I wont bother to respond to a Fin24 article again. Waste of my time

      sbhennops - 2011-09-02 04:23

      Check out Censorburger on Facebook they don't censor replies and are open to good debate. Anna Kalahari is another one if you want good information about whats happening and whats censored and not printed in the SA media. You can't rely on SA newpapers for the truth you have to look wider and spread the news yourselves if you want the truth to get out there. Start a Facebook page and spread all news that doesn't make it of international media that way. It is the only way to keep the world in touch with what really happens in SA. Th

  • Malema fan - 2011-09-01 10:52

    Perfect Mate well said that is totaly inline with how I see things to role out.

  • clx - 2011-09-01 10:58

    WHERE ARE MY COMMENTS FIN24?????? I POSTED 3 IN THE PAST HOUR ON THIS SITE WHERE ARE THEY?

      Ayoba - 2011-09-01 14:35

      You typed your words in white. Next time use black or automatic.

      dogue - 2011-09-01 15:33

      Did you post anything against Zuma? A couple of weeks ago I had a post that vanished, where I accused him of being corrupt. I'm assuming it got censored, even though I explained that it was proven in court and Mbeki even fired him for it. So much for freedom of speech. Maybe you said something not allowed...?

      dogue - 2011-09-01 15:50

      My reply to you also vanished...

      dogue - 2011-09-01 15:58

      Did you post anything against Zuma? A couple of weeks ago I had a post that vanished, where I accused him of being corrupt. I'm assuming it got censored, even though I explained that it was proven in court and Mbeki even fired him for it. So much for freedom of speech. Maybe you said something not allowed...?

  • Aaron Gumede - 2011-09-01 11:03

    @chris.khanye You are not saying anything factual about nationalism but individuals and irelevant theories, I am waiting to hear you saying nationalism failed here and there because 1,2,3. That will be a debate required for the topic, the same developed world Motsepe and you are reffering to, are major beneficiaries of resources here and they are developing their world and their people while we suffer and die of hunger. The British wars and tribes is no issue now.

      NJE - 2011-09-01 12:47

      Motsepe is confused

      Nasdaq7 - 2011-09-01 13:49

      You have the internet, why don't you do some research on nationalization yourself? http://www.eluniversal.com/2011/08/30/venezuelas-oil-gdp-thins-out.shtml "Pdvsa has a problem because it is unable to increase its oil output, as shown in the GDP. Oil activity is narrower; the state-run oil company has a production problem and also is getting absurdly into debt."

  • Aaron Gumede - 2011-09-01 11:06

    @africanwolf Are you blaming nationalism or corrupt individuals? did you ever asked yourself why it works in China, Venezuela and Botwsana?

      Nasdaq7 - 2011-09-01 14:36

      The bottom line is private businesses provide more jobs and more tax for a government, are more efficiently run and grow much faster than state-run businesses and can pay their workers better salaries than nationalized businesses.

      dogue - 2011-09-01 15:56

      Nationalism? I assume you mean nationalisation. China is currently capitalist to the extreme, dog eat dog, no workers rights, no right to strike, very low wages... Venezuela appears to be worse off after nationalisation and Botswana I don't know about it much but nationalisation can work in a country with very low levels of corruption. That is not SA.

      dogue - 2011-09-01 16:10

      Nationalism? I assume you mean nationalisation. China is currently capitalist to the extreme, dog eat dog, no workers rights, no right to strike, very low wages... Venezuela appears to be worse off after nationalisation and Botswana I don't know about it much but nationalisation can work in a country with very low levels of corruption. That is not SA. (This is the second attempt to post this. Is this some technical glitch or censorship?)

      Smish - 2011-09-02 14:27

      @Nasdaq, the minerals belong to the people of south africa, why should we share the profits minerals with anglo's board members when almost everyone who works in the mine is south african, logic would require you to understand that by nationalising the mines we are cutting out the opportunistic so called investors who require above inflation returns for their investments but wont give reasonable wages to the miners labouring deep in the ground. Motsepe should be the last person to talk right now, he has made money of the backs of hard working honest miners.

  • WIM - 2011-09-01 11:35

    Great Patric, realistic leaders like you makes one feel better on the future of this country.Problem still is , as you say the propotion of positive bussiness leaders in relation to polititions/tenderpreneurs who are only focussed on power/money is now stupidly sqew. Does not matter how much you love this country and its people, if you are not ANC related and/or toy toy orientated you have no chance to influence the goverment. If you, Ciril and a few other ANC bussinessmen stand together to oppose the greedy faction you will get overhelming support from the majority .

  • Vince York - 2011-09-01 12:18

    Mzi Khumalo has put the devil of a ghost into all BEE entities with the Reserve Bank whipping away R1Billion worth of assets recently! Farms redistributed have been BOUGHT back in large context by original owners, maybe "ANC hated whites"!! Tokyo has largely unbundled whatever he can in time, and will most likely end up sucking fine wine on his estate croaking similarly to the 'golden oldies' Tshabalala whose golden voice is now reminiscent of a crack drug addict! Leaves Cyril floating high on ALL EXCESSIVE PROFITEERING as about the only last remnant of really successful BEE but who will soon quiver into oblivion compared to the tribal "Kwa_Zuma/Gupta Arcellor/Chancellor & Royalty etc INC Dynasty". Amazing how this rainbow faded since the zuma administered ANC set about terming opposition as ENEMIES and WAR and CONFLICTS amidst ducking & diving and wheeling and dealing - instead of terms denoted by Democratic values.

  • 46664 - 2011-09-01 12:54

    What better way to get rid of ailing mines than to sell it back to the govt who will in turn squeeze the taxpayer to subsidies its losses....Clever Motsepe!!

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